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| Purchase a Fly-Cutter http://www-.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10102&t=12700 |
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| Author: | Mackie [ Wed Jul 04, 2007 12:42 am ] |
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Does anyone know where I can purchase a fly cutter? Is It the kind of thing that can be brought at a well stocked local hardware store? Do they come in different sizes, and If so what size is used to cut rosette channels and soundholes? Thanks |
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| Author: | crazymanmichael [ Wed Jul 04, 2007 12:59 am ] |
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they are common hardware items. any woodworking supply will have them, includin the catalogues such as woodcraft, woodworkers supply, highland, etc. that being said, they are not one of my favourite tools as they are somewhat dangerous and require meticulous setup and frequent sharpening, as well as grinding the cutters to appropriate size to do rosettes. and i think there are better ways of doing just about whatever you can imagine one to be used for. i would look at the laminate trimmer based shop made jigs in a number of threads in the archives as an inexpensive and better solution. |
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| Author: | jonhfry [ Wed Jul 04, 2007 1:27 am ] |
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I bought one at rockler. I live in houston so we have some bigger wood worsking stores. I could not find one at home depot or the like. you should look into any type of wood working store that may be near you. I am learning as i go, but am finding less and less use for the fly cutter. The soundholes I have cut are about 4 inches so take that into consideration for size. I used it to cut the outer and inner border of my rosettes and then chiseled out the rest of the channel. Like I said, I am learning as I go. I will be using a router or dremel for doing my circular cuts and rosettes in the future though. It is a good tool in the begining but I am finding less and less use. If you have a nice router, i would use the money to buy a circle cutting jig though. As hesh warned me, be careful with a fly cutter. If you leave an adjustment screw loose you could have an automatic projectile that could probably kill. |
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| Author: | davidmor [ Wed Jul 04, 2007 1:31 am ] |
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I have the Stewmac dremel base and circle cutter and it works great. It has micro adjustments so you can sneak up on the exact circle size you need based on your rosette. I looked at the fly cutters and decided that there is just too big a risk for things to go very wrong very quickly! The Stewmac setup might seem like a lot of money at first, but it is one of the best purchases I have made in a while. I use the router base all the time for lots of things. It was well worth it IMO. 
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| Author: | burbank [ Wed Jul 04, 2007 1:35 am ] |
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I believe Cumpiano still uses one, but his is a very beefy unit, used on a heavy duty drill press. But I agree with the others here. I've used both, and the jig with a laminate trimmer is a far safer, more predictable way to go. Here's a couple of links that give you an idea of what's involved if you're inclined to build the Wells/Karol type. It can be done cheaply in an afternoon. Sylvan Wells' site My site |
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| Author: | Ricardo [ Wed Jul 04, 2007 1:47 am ] |
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Here's my version of the jig. A word of warning when working with UML - its squirrelly that is drill bits have a habit of wandering so I ended up using some hardwood instead. If I had it to do over again I'd make it all in hardwood. I use this jig for rosette cutting and the fly cutter for cutting out the sound hole. You can also get the fly cutter from Lee Valley. 
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| Author: | Hank Mauel [ Wed Jul 04, 2007 4:38 am ] |
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If you must use a fly cutter, build a work board that will attach to the drill press table and make a center guide for the (usually) 1/4" drill bit on the center shaft of the fly cutter. Use a hardened drill bushing with the appropriate id and drill your top to fit over this guide. Keep the cutter bits about 1/2" back towards the drill chuck so that the drill bit enters into the bushing first, then continue to lower the quill until the cutter starts to touch the top. Go slowly and check your depth of cut. Back when I used this approach, I found 300 rpm to be a pretty decent cutting speed for the drill press. DO this set up with the drill press NOT RUNNING.  Once it's all aligned and you are ready, power up.
If you want some photos of this device, PM me with your email address and I'll attach a couple photos to a reply. |
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| Author: | Ricardo [ Wed Jul 04, 2007 4:39 am ] |
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Make that UHML not UML on my post. |
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| Author: | Mackie [ Wed Jul 04, 2007 5:33 am ] |
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Thanks everyone for taking the time to respond. Ok, I'm convinced, I'll get a Laminate trimmer. All you have to do is mention saftey, and you have my full attention. <b>Todd wrote:FWIW, the Wells/Karol jig, a decent laminate trimmer, and a 1/16" and 1/8" bit will pretty much cover anything you'll do on a rosette - the cut is very clean and you get micrometer adjustment for channel positioning.</b> Todd (or anyone else) could you recommmend "a decent laminate trimmer"? Happy 4th everyone! |
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| Author: | Hank Mauel [ Wed Jul 04, 2007 7:03 am ] |
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[QUOTE=Mackie] Todd (or anyone else) could you recommmend "a decent laminate trimmer"? Happy 4th everyone![/QUOTE] Porter Cable 310 or 309 are slick units. Check out the internet for "Best Buy" prices. They have a 1/4" collet and you can get very nice adapter sleeves to hold your 1/8" shank bits. Most woodworking catalogs/router bit catalogs have the adapters. Get what you need to have a dedicated adapter for each 1/8" shank bit you have. Really saves time and they can be stored, all mated up, ready to pop into the router. |
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| Author: | Mackie [ Wed Jul 04, 2007 7:16 am ] |
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thank you Hank, I'll look into It. |
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| Author: | PaulB [ Wed Jul 04, 2007 2:41 pm ] |
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I wish I'd heard about the safety issues of fly cutters a few years ago before I bought mine. Got it home from the store, bunged it in the drill press and turned it on  . Turned it off and put it a a drawer where it'll remain. Never seen a tool with so much potential for removing fingers - it's too easy to under estimate the risk involved.
I made a circle cutting jig for my cheap dremel copy (that is actually better quality than the dremel I have at work), and have never looked back. I remember reading about a bloke who put fly cutter in some sort of cnc router. Since the cutters were only held in place by grub screws and 30000 rpm doesn't care much about grub screws. One of the cutters flew off, through the protective screen in front of the bloke, through the blokes chest and took a chunk out of the masonary wall behind him. |
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| Author: | Kent Chasson [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 11:42 am ] |
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Just to present more of the other side of the issue, I've used routers and fly cutters and... For the price of a router and nice circle cutter jig, you can buy a dozen fly cutters, grind them accordingly and dedicate them for use in different parts of different rosettes. Maybe not a help if you only plan on building a couple of guitars but fiddling with a router and making test cuts to check your measurments is sure a pain. Also, if you use small purfling rings (like .040" b/w/b lines), plan on buying a lot of expensive router bits because they break. Safety is an issue but the hazards are pretty obvious and not hard too overcome. |
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| Author: | Greg [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 12:49 pm ] |
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I've used both. The fly cutter works and is cheaper but the circle cutter dremel or laminate trimmerdoes a for better job. My fly cutter is staying in the drawer with the small gouge of fingernail still attched. Go wit the router system. Love my dremel. |
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| Author: | Mackie [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 1:15 pm ] |
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Thanks Kent for sharing you experiences with both the trimmer and fly-cutter. Todd It good to have choices, and you gave me plenty. Since I'm happy with my Porter Cable 690LRVS, I'll probably go with the 310. I googled the The Wells/Karol jig and got nothing. Can someone tell me more about It, and where to get it? Do I have to make It? I hope not. Are there any circle cutting jigs that i can buy that will work on the PC310? Thanks for all the help |
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| Author: | crazymanmichael [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 1:38 pm ] |
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look 5 posts up; todd stock posted a picture of it! |
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| Author: | Mackie [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 2:54 pm ] |
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I saw the picture Michael, I just wanted to know more about It. Is It availble from one of the supply houses or something builders make themselves? Thanks just the same. |
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| Author: | Mackie [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 3:13 pm ] |
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Todd Wrote:Sylvan Wells usually has a few ready-made examples of the Wells/Karol jig made up for his students - call him up and see if you can score one from him. Todd I think I was trying to post at the same time as you. I'll give Sylvan Wells a call. Thank you. |
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| Author: | Arnt Rian [ Thu Jul 05, 2007 6:06 pm ] |
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Here is a link to an older thread about my version of the Wells / Karol rosette jig |
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